RIP Rifter Fleet Issue

03Mar09

That’s right, my favourite Rifter has passed away. It was always going to happen, especially after all the hype I gave her. Still, it was a sad day. I’d grown oddly attached to her.

I found a Taranis on a gate so I warped in at range and tried to goad it into fighting me. He seemed to be responding positively until a Vexor warped in and landed in the fight too. After that there wasn’t much I could do and the two of them made short work of my beloved frigate. Oh well, at least they had the decency to apologise for the gank in local. Just goes to show, they must have been scared of her. Who needs a Taranis and a Vexor to take down a Rifter?

The Rifter is dead. Long live the Rifter.

To make up for this I quickly saddled up a new Rifter and headed out into the black. A pilot called Saeris, who I made friends with in Old Man Star a few days ago, challenged me to a Rifter duel. Now this is something I’m always up for so I accepted and made all speed towards Heydieles where he was waiting for me. I warped to his safespot at 100 km and it was on. Both ships closed and opened fire as soon as we hit lock range. Our guns were screaming as we both cranked them up to their maximum settings. Early on I began to take lots of damamge. Saeris seemed to have the advantage but as both ships began to run out of armour my damage control kicked in and allowed me to get in a couple of repair cycles while my final two volleys tore through his hull and destroyed his Rifter. It was a great fight and I came out of it with 23% hull integrity.

If nothing else this has finally cemented in my mind that a damage control is a better choice than a gyrostabiliser in my final low power slot.

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14 Responses to “RIP Rifter Fleet Issue”

  1. Sorry to hear about the RFI dying. She was a good ship and will be missed dearly.

  2. Haha, so you’ve tricked everyone into believing gyrostab is better and now you’re beating them with a DC setup;)

  3. I don’t understand, from experience, how anyone would think the Gyro is better. It just doesn’t make sense from any standpoint.

    Being alive longer means firing longer, which means more damage is dealt. Sure the raw DPS isn’t better. But you’re also, ya know, alive longer.

    • I know, it makes much more sense and I used to fly them like that until I investigated Kane’s fits. Now I’m going back to the tried and tested damage control.

    • Gyro can be better in situations when you speedtank as it helps you kill your target quicker, which gives others less time to interfere.

  4. Sorry to hear about the rifters demise, Your right about a DCU they are gold

  5. Let the flags lower to half.

  6. Raise to pint to the good ship lost! Also, I prefer the DCU on my fits as well.

  7. I know I’d rather have +50% effective HP than 10-20% more damage. Shame about your Rifter – it was a tough nut to crack.

  8. Sniff, bye little rifter, we will miss you. wwwwaaaahhhh I hate to see a good ship go down. DCU baby

  9. 11 Raelyf

    All things considered, I like my gyrostab.

    But clearly, maths are needed! and long winded explanations.

    ————————–This is probably as far as any sensible person should read.

    Numbers run with my skills – but ratios should hold to
    Case 1: Gyrostabilizer II; EPH: 2662 DPS: 118.4 DEF: 15 over 25

    Case 2: DCU II; EPH: 3667 DPS: 98.3 DEF: 18 over 29

    Difference C2/C1: EPH: 72.6% DPS: 120.5%
    Difference C1/C2: EPH: 137.8% DPS: 83.0%

    Basically what it comes down to is a choice between 37.8% EPH or 20.5% DPS. All things equal, the EPH bonus seems like the way to go. However, fighting anything sporting an active tank quickly degrades the effectiveness of the damage control, as does flying in a gang since if your not being shot at clearly dps is the way to go, however marginal. A gyrostab also may make the difference between ganking your target and getting out before backup arrives and running away in your pod. For close fights though, thats reversed.

    ***Weirdly, 20.5% increase in damage seems wrong to me. A t2 gyrostab gives 10% DMG and 10.5% ROF, but that shouldn’t work out to a straight 10+10.5% dmg —
    DPS = DMG/ROF. DMG*1.1/ROF*0.895 = (DMG/ROF)*1.229
    So it seems like the DPS bonus should be 22.9%. Am I missing something?

    • 12 qsicle

      Weirdly, 20.5% increase in damage seems wrong to me.

      Indeed. This is because of the voodoo that happens with percent numbers. Reduce a number by 50%, and you’re cutting it in half. But boost it by 50%, you are definitely not doubling it! Damage per shot is a number that gets better the bigger it gets, yet rate of fire is a variable that improves when decreased. Which is exactly what the module does.

      If you do 90 damage every 10 seconds, your DPS is 9. Now give the rate of fire a 10% boost (reduce it by 10%). Well, that’s obviously per 9 seconds now, which boosts the DPS to 10. Think that looks like a 10% boost? You’d be wrong then; boosting it to 9.9 would be a 10% boost. Going from 9 to 10 DPS is closer to a 11.2% boost in DPS.

      Pretty much Damage Control for me. True that you’ll end the fight sooner… but I’d rather have the overall better potency in this case. Frigate fights are pretty short as it is, and something that has the means to permatank my guns would probably still do so even after the damage mod.

      • 13 Raelyf

        Yeah, I understand why it happens – just confused as to why EFT is giving me a flat 20.5% increase when it seems to me it should be 22.9%. Either EVE’s mechanics apply the ROF reduction differently than I’m expecting ( ROFf = ROFi*(1-0.105), ie a 10.5% reduction multiplies your ROF by 0.895 ) or EFT is handling it incorrectly. If the later, EFT may significantly underestimate dps on ships with many damage mods.

        In any case, I think the choice is very tough. Overloading makes a higher dps even more attractive, and I generally overload my guns the entire fight when it’s frigate on frigate. Also, it’s not so much that I’m concerned about someone outright permatanking me – its that the higher dps means your oponent will get less repair cycles.

        • 14 qsicle

          I’m gonna go out on a limb and say EFT is doing it wrong – I just can’t see how anyone would go out of their way to program it so that -10.5% doesn’t actually mean a 10.5% reduction in fire rate.

          I can, however, see Gripen just programming EFT to take the DPS and improve it by the percent directly, rather than actually simulating the rate of fire (saves on coding).

          That’s a pretty good point on the repair cycles. I hadn’t considered the possibility of the extra damage helping with “pinching it off” early and preventing a cycle or two from even happening.


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